|
|
| |
THIS
SECTION CONTAINS THE PROFESSIONAL OR SEMI PROFESSIONAL
OPINIONS OF PEOPLE REGARDING THE CLAW ANALYSIS BASED ON
VISUAL PRESENTATION. ANALYSIS WAS DONE BLIND TESTED.
OPINIONS WERE GIVEN WITH NO KNOWLEDGE OF THIS WEBSITE OR
THE HYPOTHESIS THAT I PROPOSE WHICH IS THAT THE CLAW MAY
BE OF EXTRA TERRESTRIAL ORIGIN BASED ON PERSONAL
EXPERIENCE AND KNOWN DATA. |
|
|
|
|
NAME:
Goes by the name of "Feather_Z9_NCAcoast's
from California"
LOCATION:
FORUM AT GARDENWEB.COM
ASSESSMENT QUALIFICATIONS:
Former
Wildlife Rehabilitator With A Local Wildlife Rescue Team
DETAILS:
Avid birder who loves to
watch ravens playing in the sky. I am a former wildlife
rehabilitator with a local wildlife rescue team - I took in many
species of injured birds, ranging in size from tiny hummingbirds
to the very large California Brown Pelicans, but specialized in
corvids and other passerines, owls and small raptors. While I
miss rehab work, I am content that I made the right decision in
stopping.
In my container garden, I
have set up several hummingbird feeders and have seed feeders on
another window of the apartment I live in. (One of the reasons I
stopped doing rehab work is due to lack of facilities. Living in
an apartment is simply not conducive to helping many species of
birds).
ANALYSIS:
starmanuk50 is my forum username in this communication.
Feather_Z9 is the former wildlife rehabilitators forum name.
Could you please tell me if you can identify this
species?
I have created a link to photo.
http://www.geocities.com/star_child15/ What_Species.html
Thankyou. |
Here is a link that might be useful:
species photo
------------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| Looks like it could either be part of a crow's claw or
part of a dog's claw. Hard to tell without magnification. .
.can you take the claw and put it on the scanner directly
and scan it at 300 or more dpi resolution? |
--------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species reply??
I will upload more images of it from the opposite side.
Perhaps you could use photoshop to magnify image to get a
better look? I will try and enlarge for you.
Thanks for the reply. |
----------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species link??
| Have enlarge image which can be found here
http://www.bdsc07177.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/species.htm
|
Here is a link that might be useful:
pictures here
RE: Unknown species comment
| The canal i mentioned appears to be made of bone running
the full length of sample. Is this unusual in any way? |
---------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| If it weren't so darned small, I'd be tempted to say
Townsend's Solitaire, or juvenile Bohemian Waxwing. . .
Female or juvenile Yellow-rumped Warbler also fits your
description.
Dark-eyed Juncos nest at that altitude. . .and are
similar, but without the yellow. . .
Still, check out Willow Flycatcher. . .and - just for fun
- the western form of Bewick's Wren. . .
Golden-crowned Kinglets DO have the yellow "flashings" on
the wings, with that wing bar; however, they also have a
distinctively colored head and face. . .
Pine Siskins, of course, seem to match your description
very well, especially of the yellow wing linings that flash
in flight.
Female American and Lesser Goldfinches also match your
description, as do winter plumaged female Lawrence's -
except that they seem to be strictly a California bird. . .
Other than these, I cannot think of anything that even
comes close. . .
Dear starmanuk,
All I got when I tried to click your link, was a brief
glimpse of the page, no picture had time to download, then I
was taken to a "Bad Request" page and it wouldn't let me go
back without taking me yet again to that other page. |
----------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| starmanuk, I couldn't load the second photo, but I still
think it's either canine or corvine. |
-------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| Thanks Feather Z9 for that comment "starmanuk, I
couldn't load the second photo, but I still think it's
either canine or corvine". Why do you not know though which
one it could be? is there something that makes you think it
COULD be canine? are there any characteristics of it that
appear unusual to you? Why can you not rule out either
species? As you where able to load the 1st photo i will
replace it with another one to give you a better look. Are
you aware of any species with the canal running through it
like this? I will eventually share with you my viewpoint on
this which is unusual to say the least but this way i can
get opinions without giving out any information and assess
the data/opinions better. New picture is uploaded. I am
on broadband so maybe you are 56k modem? and that is
why pics not all loading? |
------------------------------------------
At this point I replaced the first image
with the image of the Gary Lowrie claw which has been analysed
by a scientist who concluded that the claw was an unknown
species and was not in the D.N.A Database.
------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| starmanuk, 56 K modem. And because it's not curved
enough for a corvid (however, that doesn't mean the claw
couldn't have been broken and worn down at some point), and
because it's got the rough markings on it - like a dog's
toenail pulled out and down.
HOWEVER,
it could also be some other species entirely. Where and
when and under what circumstances did you find this? Were
there any other "parts" around?
I'll try again later....and see if I can figure this out.
But a full on scan rather than a photo, at 300 dpi, would
help immensely. ;)
Rachel,
The more I read of your descriptions the more I have this
tickling sensation in my brain! It's like - this bird just
wants to be found out - it's as if, the bird's name is on
the tip of my tongue and just hasn't come out yet! Some
feather's tickling my bain, teasing it to try and remember!
I am even checking my European books! Have been looking
at juvenile and female Crossbills, but of course, those are
much too large for what you have described. . .
Looked at female American Redstart. . .and that's close,
but still too large and waaay out of range.
Hutton's Vireo's are decidedly California (and parts of
Arizona) birds, but the Gray Vireo is seen in northwestern
Colorado. There's no yellow on this one, however. Female
Plumbeous is close - except that it has a distinctive
eye-ring.
But rather than keep guessing, I have to ask - can we at
least see the photos, no matter how bad they are?
|
Webmaster
comments:
Feather
Remarks "IT COULD ALSO BE SOME OTHER SPECIES ENTIRELY"
Webmaster
comments:: The Corvids are a large family composed of the
familiar crows and jays, plus close relatives like magpies,
treepies, nutcrackers and choughs. Species in
family is 115.
Feather
stated it was not curved enough for a corvid which includes crow
and magpie which are common species in my area. The claw is
intact and I can rule out the Dog claw being an option. I do not
have a dog.
Supposition: My pet cats could have brought claw in from garden
but no neighbours have dogs and claw was caught in doormat not
sitting on it as if it had been dropped from inside of house.
RE: Unknown species??
Hi Feather :)
Are you referring to the original picture you saw or the one
i have just uploaded today? |
-----------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| By "Palumbo," could he have possibly meant "Plumbeous"?
starmanuk, I meant the photo from the first time.
Rachel,
Hold one. You said that it had yellow and black wing
patches? I thought you said earlier that there were black
lines resembling a military insignia and bordered in
white???
Now I am really confused. *LOL* It must have been really
frustrating for you - who has, over the years I have seen
you post, been very good at IDing. . .to have this anamoly
appear. . . |
Webmaster
comments:
Feather
was referring to my first picture which was from my claw and not
from the Gary Lowrie case.
Re: Unknown species??
| starmanuk,
I went to your page again and took a look at the other
photos.
Since its really small I am going to have to say some
sort of songbird or perhaps a small mammal - squirrel,
perhaps? Looks like a claw?
Do you know what it is? And again, I have to ask - under
what circumstances did you find these samples, and were
there other "parts" nearby that might help identify it, or
are you having us all on for fun? |
Webmaster
Comments:
Feather now thinks
because of its size that it could be some sort of mammal like a
squirrel or possibly a songbird.
-----------------------------------------------
RE: where sample obtained
| The sample was found inside my house caught on my
doormat. There were no other parts to the Claw. As you do
not think it is corvid that rules out common birds in my area
which are magpies and crows. What makes you think i am
having you all on for fun? Is it that unusual looking? |
-----------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| Feather If this species was to be standing upright how
tall would it be based on size of sample in your opinion and
assuming it is a claw? |
----------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| starmanuk: Cat, then, feline, and I only thought you
might be kidding because, well, there are people out there
who do that from time to time. My humble apologies to you if
you were serious. . .
Rachel,
How bad were the pics anyway? Would it still be possible
to scan them in and maybe send one my way?
Let me know. . .and keep up the great detective work!
FF |
---------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species
| Feather are you saying that you think the sample based
on size could theoretically be about the height of a cat?
what type of cat? lemur or ordinary domestic cat? Could it
be as high as 3 feet tall if standing upright? If i assume
for argument sake that the claw is one of the toes on my
feet, in your opinion could it support the weight of a
creature if said entity was standing upright at for example
3 feet tall? |
---------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| Hard to tell, starmanuk. . .hard to tell, without said
sample in my hand, that is. . .
Scott, what were you talking about? Your comment
regarding the Whiskered Auklet seemed a little out of
context to the rest of this conversation???? Was it meant
for the Mute Swan post or what? Maybe I missed something? I
am known for that on occasion. *LOL* |
---------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species conclusions
| The new picture that i uploaded the other day is not the
claw i have but is something similar in certain details. The
first image on the page i liked to is the one i refer to. It
was sent to the University of California at Berkeley by a
leading doctor (who i shall mention by name shortly)to the
head of the Zoology department, and they didnt know what it
was and sent a letter back to that effect. Then they took it
to a primate zoologist at Sandiago Zoo and she looked at it
and compared it to everything in books and said it could be
a lemur, it could be a monkey grooming claw it could be a
mongoos claw, it could be this and that. So she took an
instrument and found a canal running from one end of the
claw to the other end. She thought this was strange. So the
doctor who submitted the sample asked her "Do you know any
other primates that have a claw with a canal in it. "No" she
said "But i know that there are some claws that will contain
a poison gland". So he asked her "What is your opinion
doctor?" and she replied "I do not know what it is." So he
asked her if she was willing to put that in writing and she
said yes. So she turned around in her chair, a noted primate
zoologist and typed a letter saying that she did not know
where it came from or what animal it belonged to. As such
the original claw I have shown you has also a canal running
through it and this is why i think it is an unknown species.
You are wondering where i am leading with this arent you? I
will tell you shortly but what is your opinion as regards
this canal and the noted primate zoologists comments and its
distinctive feature similar to my claw sample |
--------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species??
| starmanuk,
Poison claw embedded in your carpet in
your house? Whoa, is someone out to get you, or does one of
your friends have a poisonous mammal? (Which species would
that be? It's right on the tip of my tongue!)
Can they not collect a DNA sample from the
core of the claw?
It could be a bird, however; or it could
be the sheath of the claw that slips off a dog or cat when
it's shed.
Do you think it could be a spur from a
snake, perhaps?
Now I am very interested in where you are
going with this! DO tell, DO tell! |
-------------------------------------------------------
RE: Unknown species final conclusions
| Getting a D.N.A Sample costs several
thousand pounds. Well I have 2 cats and I cannot see it
being the sheath of the claw that slips off a dog or cat
unless its a very big cat.
Ok Prepare for a very strange disclosure.
I have being researching the claw and the only way to get
accurate responses for my research is to do what is called a
blind test. Basically I told you nothing about the claw
accept that it was found in my house after you had answered
a few questions for me. Disclosing my Country location was
an error as that could have made you rule out certain
species not native to the region but your comments on the
claw not being Bovine of which there are 115 species is most
interesting as that would rule out pretty much all the birds
in my area.The Doctor I refer to is one Dr Roger Leir and he
is a podiatrist surgeon who stumbled across patients who
appeared to have strange objects in there bodies which when
analysed were found to have extra terrestrial isotopes. He
also researched the other claw I mentioned which is from the
Gary Lowrie case. Gary Lowrie claims to be having ufo
encounters in his house and managed to obtain the claw. The
claw is an unknown species and does not exist in the D.N.A
Database. I also have a claw and yes i also believe this
claw may infact be from an extra terrestrial entity as I
also have had many ufo experiences all through my life. The
claw I have was caught in the hall rug inside my house and
it has the same canal feature of the lowrie case. I cannot
explain where it came from. I have a website which you have
been visiting but i took it offline so as not to give you
any indication as to my intentions and so as not to pollute
the data you provided and only put up a basic page with a
few pictures for you. The data you provided in on my
website. The actual domain name is http://www.alienimplant.co.uk
Thank you for your input. My intentions
were and still are sincere. I still need to research further
and obtain opinions from other people such as zoologists etc
and the final analysis will be to have the D.N.A sample
analysed.
Thanks :)) |
Here is a link that might be useful:
alienimplant.co.uk
WEBMASTER: AND NOW THE
PREDICTABLE IGNORANT RESPONSES I FULLY EXPECTED TO RECEIVE. AND
NOT ONE OF THEM BOTHERED TO RESEARCH THIS SUBJECT BUT MOST HAVE
VERY STRONG OPINIONS THAT IT IS A DELUSIONS PERSON NAMELY ME WHO
IS IN NEED OF SOME MEDICATION. IM SURE IF THE TRUTH EVER REALLY
DOES COME OUT THAT THEY WILL BE THE ONES NEEDING THE MEDICATION.
RE: Unknown species??
| Was this all a setup to plug your UFO
website? Try a UFO forum instead of a birding forum, thanks.
Scott |
RE: Unknown species??
RE: Unknown species??
100.....100 !!!!! How did this thread
reach 100??....
This stupid,, pointless, ridiculous thread!!!
With all the incredible pictures and opinions that have been
posted on this website, how did this garbage reach 100
replies??
Perhaps symbolic of this world, and a
good lesson on how much of everybodys time can be wasted by
one person on NOTHING!!!! |
--------------------------------------
WEBMASTER: AS THE THREAD REACHED 100 POSTS I STARTED A NEW
THREAD FOR OPINIONS AND CONCLUSIONS
-------------------------------------
Claw sample conclusions and opinions
Posted by
starmanuk50 (My
Page) on Sat, Aug 16, 03 at 12:49
Claw sample conclusions and opinions
welcome regarding my claw sample from the unknown species
thread.
Riles said "pointless, ridiculous thread!!!
With all the incredible pictures and opinions that have been
posted on this website, how did this garbage reach 100
replies?? Perhaps symbolic of this world, and a good lesson
on how much of everybodys time can be wasted by one person
on NOTHING!!!!"
Interesting as this NOTHING you talk of
does not seem to exist as a known species based on some of
the features of the claw i submitted. No one has dispproved
the canal feature running down the claw as existing in any
known species yet you say it is nothing? This was not a
setup to plug my ufo site, it was genuine research and as i
had to rule out certain species such as corvids this was the
perfect place to do it. Telling you my opinions would have
destroyed the data, infact i know it would have as now that
i have explained my suspicions i am getting the usual
predictable responses from people who have not actually
researched the subject properly.
Your opinions that it is all rubbish does
not detract from the fact that the claw is still not
explainable due to this "Canal feature" it possesses. I
thank the individual known as Feather who contributed to my
ongoing research in this field and would hope that
regardless of whether i had told him of my suspicions
regarding the claw he would have still aided me to a
satisfactory conclusion. I like to think that he would.
People with closed minds are not the best researchers and
hence the best results were obtained by not disclosing the
full story and that is why I held back on some of the
information. I am now pretty sure what it is not and i am
still waiting for the answer to the canal feature? I suspect
you do not have a species to identify with this as none
exists in the database.
----------------------------
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| go away claw
guy....like scott said...go find a UFO site |
----------------------------
EMAIL REPLIES RECEIVED:
[This is a follow-up to
your posting on
Nature.Net's Bird Watching Forum, located at:
http://nature.gardenweb.com/forums/bird/ ]
(PLEASE NOTE: The member
responding to your post has chosen not to reveal his or
her email address. Therefore, you cannot reply to
this message via email.)
what I wrote was dis-respectfull.....no harm intended..I get
carried away
sometimes..
Riley
riles
---------------------------- [This message originated at GardenWeb]
Dear Starmanuk,
This thread, as you saw, went to the limit, and so, if you choose to continue,
you must post under a new heading.
I am thinking NOT extraterrestrial, but more likely some species of bird-the
canal going the length of the inside is indicative of some TERRESTRIAL species,
for, if you have ever trimmed a claw on dog, cat OR large species of bird (such
as a raven, for example), and have accidentally hit the quick, you've been
sprayed with blood. The canal is there for a reason; to allow the vein to
circulate blood to the area for new growth. See, toenails in birds, cats, dogs,
etc., are in need of healthy circulation to allow the toenail to keep growing.
Since it's encased and rounded down its length to the tip, the canal would run
until the claw starts to curve down, and stop just before it turns to a point.
In the case of the claw you have, it's not curved - therefore, it was broken off
at some point in its life before the claw was shed.
I do not believe you are being visited by aliens; I DO believe that you are
being harassed by beings, however. Fallen angels, specifically, who love to
harass people and make them think they are being visited by aliens. Since Satan
is the father of LIES, why wouldn't he feel such glee in his heart that so many
are being deceived by his workers of darkness?
I would hope that your heart is open to what I just said, and that you wouldn't
get angry - I used to believe that I had an alien implant in my arm, since
there's an "unexplained small crescent-shaped scar" there, but have later
discovered that the scar is there from when a doctor attempted to burn a wart
from that area when I was very little. I used to have UFO encounters, too - but
when I gave my life to Christ, they stopped. I'd seen bright singular spherical
lights in the sky, dancing between stars, it seemed, on a very dark night in a
riverbed close to the town I lived in, which was in turn, very close to an air
force base I had been born on. I saw a huge dark, cigar-shaped vehicle, with
green portals glowing bright against the dark, hovering above the southern
portion of that air force base, where no one ever came - and on its top and
bottom were swirling lights that changed color to every color of the rainbow. I
saw a lot of stuff back in the 1970s and early 1980s tha!
t had me convinced we were being visited by aliens. I have since discovered
that these were simply demons, pretending to be what they are not, and have read
of some interesting theories surrounding Mars and its being a place for demon
inhabitation - where they can launch their deceptions on a people who are
already sensitized to the "possibilities" of an invasion from another world. Of
course, it's a demonic world - ann ethereal one that breaks into a conscious
reality once in a while, just to fool people.
So I will pray for you. I will pray that you are no longer deceived, that you
are no longer harassed, and above all, that you are SAFE.
There is some information on what I am speaking of at the following locations,
should you ever be interested in researching it for yourself. And yes, it's
Christian.
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-c012.html
Feather
-------------------------------------------------
WEBMASTER:
I POINTED FEATHER TO A SECTION OF THIS SITE WHERE Monsignor Corrado Balducci WAS MENTIONED.
"Monsignor Balducci is a Vatican theologian and an insider close to the Pope.
He has been featured on national Italian television numerous times to
express that extraterrestrial contact is a real phenomenon and “not due to
psychological impairment”. In this testimony he explains that not only the
general populace but also highly credible, cultured, and educated people of
high status are recognizing more and more that this is a real phenomenon. He
goes on to speak about the extraterrestrial people as part of God’s creation
and that they are not angels nor are they devils. However they are probably
more spiritually evolved." [source: www.disclosureproject.com]
I do not wish to go into a theological debate in this portion of my research but it is mentioned here as it shows
how people can react to such claims of Extra terrestrial Visitation based on there belief system and how it
effects the psyche of the individual. Feather is a Christian and as such her opinion is coloured by her beliefs.
Her reply to my comment is as follows:
Feather replies by email:
"Interesting. However, due to the papacy's constant references in coming very
close to making Mary equal to Jesus, and the fact that the Catholic church has adopted
many pagan rites and rituals as belonging to Christianity, I do not consider it
Christian. . .and I said nothing of psychological impairment - I DO believe in a
spirit realm, and that realm is littered with demons, as I stated earlier.
A Vatican theologian no more impresses me than a demon pretending to be an angel
from God."
-----------------------------------------
Gardenweb forum thread continues:
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| Feather you
remarked "In the case of the claw you have, it's not
curved - therefore, it was broken off at some point in
its life before the claw was shed". The claw is intact
and is not broken off in any way. There is a curve in
the claw as far as i can see.
Can I just make a
comment made by a professional zoologist that i made
before.
"she took an
instrument and found a canal running from one end of the
claw to the other end. She thought this was strange. So
Dr leir asked her "Do you know any other primates that
have a claw with a canal in it. "No" she said "But i
know that there are some claws that will contain a
poison gland"
I do not believe it
is a poison gland. What species would have a poison
gland in central Scotland? and why would it be in my
house? |
-----------------------------------------
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| Evidently an alien
with its pet entered your house and the pet, in trying
to stay behind and take over the world, or at least,
Scotland, dug into the carpet and left its claw behind.
Someone look up "Occam's
Razor."
|
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Well hey...at least
Elly does have an open mind ;) |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| LOL......starmanuk:
BIRDS DOGS AND CATS
all have canals running through their claws - the famous
"quick" we read of is a vein that runs through,
providing nutrient-rich blood to the claw...and just
because it doesn't LOOK broken, doesn't mean that it
isn't - it MIGHT mean, however, that it had worn down
over time before it finally DID fall off.
Oh, and one more
thing. ..and I get this a lot anyway: I'm a "she." ;)
|
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Well, Feather, We
have seen your Photo and I had no doubt at all. A
perfectly fine looking woman I might add. Bill |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| I think Feather is
an alien : ) but a very very nice and good one. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| I have read this
thread (and the old one that reached 100), and I must
say...I have laughed and laughed!
Feather, when is the
Mother Ship returning for you?
~Marie |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Hey Feather, when
the mother ship does come back for you can you toss me a
phaser, or better yet one of those futuristic cameras,
the kind where you imagine the perfect bird shot and it
just conjures up the picture for you. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| LOL, actually, I am
an alien - not of his world, see. . .and am not awaiting
the mothership, but a free ride to heaven! ;) |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
Hi Feather sorry
for calling you a guy. You said
"BIRDS DOGS AND CATS all have canals running through
their claws - the famous "quick" we read of is a vein
that runs through, providing nutrient-rich blood to the
claw"
A few points if I
may.
1. I have never seen
a domestic cat with a claw like that because they do not
have a claw like that. There are no big cats in my area
and if there where they would not be in my house.
2. I do not have a
Dog.
3. We agreed that it
was not corvine. That rules out all the birds at my
location.
4. The claw is
intact. I broke the end slightly out of curiosity and
noted the canal feature.
QUESTION:
What local species are there in central Scotland of bird
or Animal that have a poison Gland in there claw? I
think perhaps there is a difference in the canal feature
and the quick you mention. Perhaps they are similar but
the Gary lowrie claw was unique and it has the same
distinctive canal running through it like my sample.
Perhaps someone could direct me to some bird claw images
so i can make a comparison?
Out of interest i
typed the question regarding any known species with
poison gland in scotland as a question in to yahoo.com
and the first entry on the page was linked to this very
forum. (smiles) |
----------------------------------------------
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| It is nice to see
every one has an open mind. This sure wasn't the
direction I thought this thread would take. I have a
book with bird claw images, but I can't remember the
name of it. I am sure our resident alien (smile) Feather
can name some references, that's right up her alley.
Richard |
----------------------------------------------------------
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| Looks like
starmanuk50 has his mind made up that this is an alien
toenail. Looks like it could be a lot of things. A
snake's tooth perhaps? Oh well, I can sympathise. I
often find sasquatch hairs in my carpet. Couldn't
possibly be the cat because these hairs are longer. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Now I'm not inclined to believe in
alien claws... Still I wouldn't dismiss this over some
silly philosophy or religion called Humanism, with its
teaching that all new ideas should be quashed without
consideration (well, apparently that's how it's taught,
since nobody dares disagree without risking the ridicule
or wrath of the "all-knowing Majority"). This nonsense
called Occam's Razor is an example. It says that if
there is one theory which can be explained logically,
and there are several others which explain the same
theory in different ways, then you should take a vote on
which theory to declare as Ultimate Truth and discard
the rest as lies. Of course, this way of doing things is
likely to result in error, but then, who cares anyway,
as long as you get more grant money?
Perhaps your hollow claw is from an
unknown species of animal which is native to this
planet. Or perhaps someone is mistaken, and it is
something known, but unfamiliar. There's no reason to
make a fuss over it, just try to get some more
information on it and determine what it is. But I would
try a different forum, since this one is really risky
when it comes to new ideas, or any possibility of new
species, as I'm sure you have found out!
Ethan
(Another "alien", like my sister (in Christ) Feather,
BTW - that's why I'm so strange in my opinions :-)
|
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| LOL@Ethan. . .go, bro!
OK......let's say the claw had
sustained an injury at some point in its early
development and then started growing again. I've seen
some pretty mangled toenails - I have an American Crow
with one....and while it doesn't appear to have been
broken off at any point in his life, I know for a fact
that it had been.
Maybe your cat dragged the claw
home on its fur? Perhaps it had been pounced on by a
crow? Crows love to harass cats. Just a thought. . .
Without a DNA test, we cannot be
100% sure of its origin, and all we can do is this:
guess a lot..... |
WEBMASTER:
Feather states
"Without a DNA test, we cannot be 100% sure of its origin"
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Ethan,
I understand Occam's Razor as
dictating that one should choose the simplest, logical
explanations over fantastical theories. Without this
principle, you get wild theories like alien toenails
instead of logical, reasonable ones like an animal claw
or tooth that was tracked in on one's shoe. The problem
is that Starmanuk is so convinced that aliens are
cruising the skies abducting people and so anything
strange he finds like this becomes evidence to support
his theories. The problem is that he is looking for
extraterrestrial evidence in normal objects, and as he
searches, the more he finds such evidence.
Unfortunately, it is not the claw that is suggesting
extraterrestrial origin, it's his mind.
There's no need to dismiss sound
philosophy or scientific principles simply because one's
beliefs or religion cannot stand up to such rational
scrutiny. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| I have heard
Occam's razor used before to claim that the theory of
intelligent design (not a religion, or a religious
theory, by the way, though many religious people believe
it) does not measure up to Darwin's theory of origins.
Problem is, if you automatically disregard any other
theory you hear, what if your theory is incorrect? You
have thrown out the correct theory, because of this idea
that the "simplest" explanation is not just the most
likely to be true, but must be true. Occam's razor
should not be used as a law of nature, but as a
guideline. When people start using it like a law instead
of a guideline, they are likely to lose their
objectivity. The fact is, intelligent design is by far
the simpler of the two main theories of origins. But it
usually gets dismissed as silliness, no different from
this idea of alien toenails, when it is in fact a valid
theory.
Don't worry, my
beliefs can easily withstand any scrutiny anybody can
put up against it. But that's a subject for some other
place. This place is supposed to be for the birds!
Ethan |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
I do not think I am
making a fuss over it Ethan merely doing research. It
seems people cannot decide what it is.
"Feather stated it was not curved enough for a corvid"
"Its not a corvid,
could be a squirrel",
"The claw cannot be
intact" when i stated it was,
"because it's got
the rough markings on it - like a dog's toenail pulled
out and down. HOWEVER,
it could also be some other species entirely"
I seem to have
caused a stir. I was not expecting to hear an outright "thats
a crows claw" comment and I did not. As to a snake, NO.
There are no snakes in my area. It was the nature of how
the claw was found caught inside the hall rug that was
curious and not just the unusual finding. I couldnt help
but notice the similarity of the lowrie case with my own
in how he obtained the claw which was under similar
circumstances, though mine was by pure chance his was
set up deliberately in order to obtain evidence.
The claw could not have been dropped onto the rug or
dragged in, it was caught under the rugs threaded
material and appeared to have been tugged off forcefully
from the "unknown species" for want of a better word as
it got tangled and entwined. I look for evidence because
i know it exists if you look hard enough. My UFO
experiences have brought me nothing but ridicule but
that makes me all the more a stronger person.
"The vast majority
of human beings dislike and even dread all notions with
which they are not familiar. Hence it comes about that
at their first appearance innovators have always been
derided as fools and madmen."
ALDOUS HUXLEY
"Nothing is as
terrible to see as ignorance in action ."
GOETHE
"When a true genius
appears in this world, you may know him by this sign,
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
JONATHAN SWIFT
Thoughts on Various Subjects
"We want the facts
to fit the preconceptions. When they don't, it is easier
to ignore the facts than to change the preconceptions."
JASSAMYN WEST
"Two things are
infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not
sure about the universe."
Albert Einstein
"A great many people
think they are thinking when they are merely rearranging
their prejudices ."
WILLIAM JAMES
"Whenever you find
that you are on the side of the majority, it is time to
reform ."
MARK TWAIN
"To be great is to
be misunderstood ."
RALPH WALDO EMERSON
"I will not
criticize another until I have walked a mile in his
mocassins ."
native american quote
". . . the inability
to view the validations of unpopular views, because the
focus of their casuistry has been reduced to mindless
invalidation ."
ELI KHAMAROV |
-------------------------------------
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| Starmanuk: "I look
for evidence because i know it exists if you look hard
enough."
I rest my case...
Oh god, let the
quote war begin! So do those out-of-context quotes from
famous people prove that your theories on aliens are
reasonable? Is that all it takes to prove one's sanity,
rationalism, etc?
Anyways, back to
birds. That's what I'm here for anyway. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Well if thats all
you are hear for then would you be so kind as to post in
the right thread as this one is for conclusions and
opinions based on the visual evidence of the sample i
provided. I am not here to waste my time or for that
matter others. If they do not wish to reply then they
have free will. Be constructive in your criticism if you
must criticise. At least they are making an effort to
remain open minded even if they do think i am alittle
far fetched in my opinions.
"Two things are
infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not
sure about the universe."
Albert Einstein |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Simply because we
do not agree with someone's theory doesn't mean we are
not open minded. We could have considered it and
rejected it. Such as in the case of the unidentified
birds in the Rocky Mountains -- In my opinion, the
unidentified birds in the Rocky Mountains could have
been a new species for that area, but very unlikely that
they were a new species that had previously never been
discovered.
With regard to the
mysterious claw. In my opinion, there are quite a few
holes in your arguments or statements Starmanuk. For
example, just because you state the claw is intact
doesn't mean that it is intact. You could be mistaken.
Another example, the fact that you do not have a dog
doesn't mean it didn't come from a dog.
Even though I am not
inclined to believe that the claw came from an alien
species this has been an interesting thread.
Richard |
--------------------------------------------
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| You said quite a
few holes in my argument. You only mentioned 2 and why
would me not having a dog make it a flaw?
Once again to
reiterate
We agreed that it
was not corvine. That rules out all the birds at my
location.
The claw is intact.
I broke the end slightly out of curiosity and noted the
canal feature. If it is not intact then please point me
to a claw picture that looks the same as it to confirm
this.
I have never seen a
dogs claw look like this and as i already stated i do
not have a dog. Remember this claw was found inside my
house and not outside. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and opinions
| The claw is from a
dog. Probably was there when you bought your house...or
a dog was in the house at some time...or the rug was
outside the house at some point... Get it? |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| I have lived in my
house for over 30 years and have NEVER HAD A DOG.
A dog was not in the
house.
The rug has never
been outside the house at some point.
It is NOT a dog
claw. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| A dog chased and
pounced on the cat, the cat got loose, but not before
dislodging an already loose toenail, hence, the cat came
home, rolled around on the rug, getting it caught in the
fibers of the rug. . .. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| I don't get this.
If there is serious research that is being pursued why
not send the claw to places that can do something to
analyze the claw and determine its origin? That should
settle it once and for all if this claw is of earthly
decent. Or is it that the research groups with a
national reputation (smithsonian, cornell dept of
ornithology....) are too close minded? |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| A universtiry
should be able to assist...perhaps Scotland Yard? Lol |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Well without going
back and reading the other post...perhaps the origin of
the claw should not be examined, rather the origin of
the rug. I dont know if it is a throw rug, or just a
continuous piece that covers the entire floor, but is it
possible that the rug itself was not locally made.
Perhaps a claw from the region the rug originated was
deposited by an animal there and was woven into the
structure of the rug? Just giving an educated
alternative to the origin of the claw. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| The
similarly-looking claw that was found elsewhere was sent
to a university in California (Stanford? Berkeley? I
forgot which) and the zoologist there concluded it was
nothing she had ever seen, apparently, and could not
account for the canal running part of the length of the
claw.(!) A zoologist?! Why did she say that when most
creatures with claws have these canals running through
part of the length of the claw? Veins just don't run
through hard, caroten-rich material like that, do they?
Nope, the vein runs thrugh a canal to provide nutrients
that allow the claw to grow.
I like Timmer's
thoughts. . .and wonder, too, where the rug came from,
even if it IS over 30 years old, it could have been
imbedded in the rug very deeply and simply, through lots
of walking, vacuuming, etc., been jarred loose enough to
be seen. . . .possibilities exist that would make it
terrestrial rather than extraterrestrial, in origin, of
course. |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Starman,
What are the names
of the researchers you sent the claw information to and
received responses from?
Scott |
RE: Claw sample conclusions and
opinions
| Ted Papenthous
(spelling may be out) a zoologist sent a letter to Dr
Leir stating he could not tell what species it is. The
canal would seem to be an unknown feature of the claw
and is not the same as the quick that has been mentioned
previously. I suspect a higher resolution would be
required in order to see this.The mat is just an
ordinary mat which had stringy threads coming out of it.
It was only a couple of years old and is not significant
except for its use of catching the claw in between the
fibers as it would appear. Any evidence such as hairs
has been lost as the rug has been thrown out due to the
cat urinating on it. Yes i guess you could argue that
the cat brought it in. I have my reservations but stick
to my belief based on personal experiences and again the
unusual circumstances surrounding the way the claw was
found. The Lowrie claw found in similar circumstances to
my own was sent to the University of California at
Berkeley to the head of the Zoology department, and they
didnt know what it was and sent a letter back to that
effect. This information is provided by Doctor Roger
Leir and is correct. I think i have exhausted my
research based on visual observation at this time. Thank
you all for your input. Most appreciated. Any further
updates will be posted on my site at
http:www.alienimplant.co.uk
special thanks to
Feather :)) |
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